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keel attachment

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titi View Drop Down
Sub Lieutenant
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote titi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: keel attachment
    Posted: 26 September 2016 at 09:09
I `m actually looking to buy a 430e which is in a fairly good condition. Inspecting the boat shows however a beginning gap at he front oft the kee/hull connection which starts already to corrode.
At the inside the keel attachments show some sealing of yellow epoxy between attachmentplates and hull which seem to be applicated afterwards.

The front and underside of the keel do not show any damages or signs of grounding.

What do you think about, Is this normal with 430es of this age and how could this problem be fixed? ( eg necessity of renewing the sealing between keel and hull would be an expensive affaire...)

As this is an epoxy version there should not be any osmosis on the hull, I heard however that the rudder is of commoon grp, so a gealshield treatment would be a good idea ?

In general epoxyhulls are lighter and louder than grphulls but more sensitive against punctual loads - is this also your experience ?

regards titi
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titi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote titi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 09:22
some photos...
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titi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote titi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 09:24
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nibheis View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nibheis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 15:17
Hi titi,

No pics visible from your posts...

My 430e has also the keel studs/bolts (SS) and plates (GS) covered with epoxy resin. This is factory I guess.

No gap between the keel and hull, but a thick black sika coat and some (little) rust leaking at the junction, most probably from the upper part of the keel (which is made of cast iron, unlike the bottom part).

Try to send pick so I can compare/help.

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titi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote titi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 15:28
another attempt to upload..there is also a gap at the rear end of the keel  which starts to rust.
my idea is to open the gap even more and fill it with sikaflex before priming the keel.
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nibheis View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nibheis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 15:58
This is more rust than I have on mine.
And the crack in the sika is also much longer... but it looks like it is just a crack in the sika, so not very important.

The bolt and plate close to the mast post look a bit dirty (I don't think mine are covered with this yellow past) ; this *could* be non-factory (or the job of a lazy worker).

For evident signs of a past grounding, check also the GRP structure on which the floor panels are screwed (the 2 white lines in the floor), the bottom of the keel (lead is fragile - but you already checked ?), and the back of the keel/hull junction (has the keel been push upwards on this side ?)

What does your surveyor say about it ?
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Rubato View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rubato Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 17:33
From what you've shown, doesn't appear to be any structural problems. However, clearly water is getting into the top part of the keel (which is cast iron). Since it appears that you are doing work on the bottom anyway, I would grind back the fairing in this area between the hull and the keel to expose all the rusted areas and then clean away the rust and reseal/fair the area.

Regarding the epoxy hull - the gel coat is exactly the same as the non epoxy hull. Therefore an epoxy barrier coat is recommended anyway (so not just the rudder)

Cheers
Steve

Hanse 400e, #168
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Lykke View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lykke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 09:13
 
Hi, I found similar rust-cracks both in front of, and in the aft part of my keel to hull connection. The cracks in the front part had once been covered with some thin layer of sikaflex. (The previous owner did not remember/know anything about this, so it maight have been done in the first year when the boat was a demo-boat...).
 
The filler between hull and keel seems to be some hard stuff that is prone to cracking. And since the top of keel probably not was painted before assembly, it will rust when exposed to seawater.
 
Until the rust problem get so large that pieces of the filler falls out, I will guess that it is sufficent to just cover the cracks with a thin layer of sikaflex to delay the process.
 
Anyone who are more concerned or have tried some more toroughly fix?
Lykke, Hanse 430e, #8 from 2007
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Sea-U View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sea-U Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 12:58
All this reminds me...
I think it is a good idea to retighten the bolts to the keel. That might help for not getting cracks.
 
Sea-U is a 370e #532 located SW Norway
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rentner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 December 2016 at 15:39
Hi we have the first ever built 430e, which was built as a racing yacht to win the "kings cup" in Mallorca "copa del Rey" although the hull is epoxy the rudder is a special design  in carbon. We had the same problem with the keel, ground out the filler, and filled with Carbon fibre and Epoxy resin.
This has not cracked again since. If you wish to know how we did it send me a PN.Wink

Hanse 430 Minnimouse (formerly, minnic)




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