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Sail Trim when reefed?

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mattplowman View Drop Down
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    Posted: 24 March 2018 at 20:00
We are the new (Dec 17) owners of a 2011 Hanse 355 #47 and are very happy with the boat. We have been very impressed by the performance in light to moderate winds and have had a great summer of cruising thus far.

I was out yesterday single-handed in approx 18-22knots and put a reef in the main to make her a bit more manageable, I had the ST jib fully unfurled. I had real issues keeping her in the groove , especially upwind, and was hoping to get any tips and techniques from other owners on sail trim under a reef? I am planning on racing over winter so need to get up to speed on how they like to be trimmed in heavier winds!

Cheers
Matt
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Old Racer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Old Racer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 March 2018 at 23:57
Although we sail a 320 we have sailed a 355 for a few seasons before.
 
The rule of thumb we apply sailing two up is first reef at 14knts second reef at 18knts if sea is flat then numbers can be adjusted a few knots up. We have never furled the jib.
 
Always found the boat to track well enough under these combinations.
 
John
Hanse 320 Olicana Inverkip Scotland
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samuel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote samuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 March 2018 at 10:10
Rig tension is very important. I only have a 31 so not quite so relevant to a 35 but rigging really needs to be tight. 24% uppers at least then work down to get 50mm pre bend but lowers set so that I can get 150mm bend with the backstay.( these will be more for your longer mast)I have increased purchase to 32:1 to flatten full main.

Condition & quality of sails has a big effect on performance (i am on my 4th St  & 3rd main in 14 years) But you have to work with what you have.
I can carry full sail in flat water up to 20kts Ok but if choppy I certainly put first reef in at 18 kts.
never reef the ST.
I do not over tighten the main but tend to leave the boom outboard a bit more than on a lot of boats. Bringing in to close to the centre line makes it hard to balance & kills speed.
Careful adjustment of the ST to get twist right is important & it only takes a couple of clicks either way on the winch. One definitely needs to get it set just right.
I have an Aries wind steering so I set it then play with the sails. It is good because unlike a helmsman it always does the same thing so i can see on the log what each tweek does to speed. if you have an autopilot with steer to wind set that then play with the trims so you can see what works. That might help


Edited by samuel - 25 March 2018 at 10:16
Daydream Believer- Hanse 311- No GBR9917T- Bradwell Essex
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mattplowman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mattplowman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 March 2018 at 00:50
Thank you for the responses  , I am out this weekend again so will try some different set-ups and see how she goes.

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MrSnow View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrSnow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 March 2018 at 19:11
Hi Matt,

I generally put 1 reef in the main at 16-18 knots, and then 2 reefs in the main and reef the ST jib at around 20-22 knots. This cures most of the weather helm I have had up to 27-28 knots. Any more than that and I consider it pub time Beer

I have found that if it is gusty then you definitely need to reef earlier as the weather helm is much, much worse than with a constant breeze.

Cheers


James
Hanse 355 #26 - Pufferfish
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samuel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 March 2018 at 22:43
Originally posted by MrSnow MrSnow wrote:

Hi Matt,

I generally put 1 reef in the main at 16-18 knots, and then 2 reefs in the main and reef the ST jib at around 20-22 knots. This cures most of the weather helm I have had up to 27-28 knots. Any more than that and I consider it pub time Beer

I have found that if it is gusty then you definitely need to reef earlier as the weather helm is much, much worse than with a constant breeze.
James

I may be wrong, but I think the OP was not so much asking about WHEN to reef but how best to trim the boat ONCE reefed to get best performance
Daydream Believer- Hanse 311- No GBR9917T- Bradwell Essex
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote echoofwight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2018 at 09:21
On my 341 I set her up exactly as Samuel does on his 312, only difference is that I have a third reef which is sometimes used. I never reef the foresail and the boat is always well balanced. I have never sailed a 345, but I have sailed long distances on a 385 which I thought sailed and tracked very well.

The question of when to reef is very much a skippers preference I think. Some like me always reef earlier than is strictly necessary, others hang on till the last moment. It also depends on point of sail, sea state and how steady the wind is.
Steve. Hanse 341 Echo of Wight, . Deep draft and rudder, white hull, Single aft cabin. Raymarine instruments. Furuno radar. Garmin AIS. Wheel Steering,   Portsmouth.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brufan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 April 2018 at 11:36
Upwind I put the first reef with approx 14-15 kts true, 2nd reef approx 18-20 kts true.
Rigging tension & Sail condition are important.  
Original ST North Sail is nearly useless (except to heel the yacht).  It's far better to put some money in a decent ST (Mine is laminate with three vertcial battens) and to reef it only with 25-28 kts + true upwind.
Upwind in a breeze, do not hesitate to tighten nearly every thing (Backstay, halyard, cunningham, main foot, ...)
Finally try not to heel over 18
For single or shorthanded upwind, If you can set main sail sheet aft boom and in cockpit.  Best is a mainsail traveller in front of wheel.  


Bruno

hanse 355 - 57

S/Y Spicy Ginger

White hull, 2 cabins, Volvo D1-30, Selden rig, removable mainsheet track system (modifications done now), Simrad-Jefa autopilot.
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Pieterman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pieterman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 April 2018 at 13:19
Hi Matt,
In my opinion and on my H315, there are different possibilities for sail trim (under reef).

First, I seldom reef the ST-jib.

Then:
- the more backstay tension, the more the main is flattenend.
- a good position of the aft reefing line pulls in a good angle. The aft reefing line works as reefing line holding the sail down AND as an outhaul. When reefing for longer times I sometimes put an extra rope to "reef" and use the installed reefing line more as outhaul. (Sailing single handed, I enjoy the Hanse reefing system very very much, but as a sailor I must say the trimming options aren't good enough).
- the front part of the hanse reefing system works as a cunningham at the moment of reefing. The more pulled, the more the sailing point goes forward and influences the steering. When your reef is already 'operational', you can have the same affect by tensioning the halyard.
- the downhaul: the more loose, the more twist and the more forgiving in choppy or wavy conditions. The effect of the downhaul diminishes a lot when sailing close-hauled because the main sheet works more and more as an downhaul as well. And it is often sailing close-hauled I like to reef. 
- I do not have a traveller, but sailing close-hauled in much wind I like to outboard the end of the boom by loosening the main sheet when I still have too much sail. Then playing with the downhaul becomes more important. Putting the second reef is an option as well then ... :-)

Hope this helps you a bit.
Pieter
Pieterman
Hanse 315 #523
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