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Ratbasher
Rear Admiral Joined: 31 May 2017 Location: Cyprus Status: Offline Points: 591 |
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Posted: 22 September 2019 at 14:40 |
Sorry - best board to lift in a 400 is the long one just inboard of the chart table. I keep this secured with just a couple of screws. Don't be too concerned, however; decades of different boats has taught me that they all leak one way or t'other…...
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H400 (2008) 'Wight Leopard', Gosport UK
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Ratbasher
Rear Admiral Joined: 31 May 2017 Location: Cyprus Status: Offline Points: 591 |
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If you haven't noticed water in the more easily visible spaces like under the galley then you probably haven't got any real concerns. The void spaces inside the stringers are pierced by approx. 3cm diameter holes at either end to allow water to flow through. In the 400, the overflow pipe from the FW tank empties inside a stringer in the main cabin. Hanse could have taken it back to the bilge pump area but then that pump itself is sited higher and further aft than the lowest part of the boat. I do like these boats but there are several design flaws we just have to learn to overcome.
I did raise all the boards when I had the issue with the hull valves and it was very informative; always a good idea to get to know the guts of your boat and I'd recommend you do the same. However, all I need do now is simply raise one board in the main cabin once or twice a month to check what's there and extract water if necessary. If the level rises to the point that it gets to the bilge pump I'd be very concerned and I'm re-siting the pump. |
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H400 (2008) 'Wight Leopard', Gosport UK
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Silver lining
Lieutenant Joined: 23 October 2016 Location: N ireland Status: Offline Points: 41 |
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I have never checked my stringers , but with all the info you have mentioned , I better !! - does water get in here and not get out ?
Where should I check ? - or where does the water ‘usually’ collect ? - under my galley sink is dry , slight condensation - and a musty smell ... so maybe I need to investigate further and remove all floor boards .. Thanks for all this info .
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'Silver Lining' 400e #199
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Ratbasher
Rear Admiral Joined: 31 May 2017 Location: Cyprus Status: Offline Points: 591 |
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Its been interesting to read this and the many other threads on this forum about water in the bilges. I had two episodes, one serious the other simply annoying. The first was failure of hull valve sealants on post-purchase launch which in my mad rush to find the cause had me lift every single bit of flooring down below to find the cause as surprisingly you had to shine an angled light on the hull valve before you could actually see the water fanning out from 2 valves. The second is an ongoing slow creepage largely due to overflow from the FW tank, something I later proved on exploring the inside of the stringers with an endoscope.
I was concerned until I remembered my old long-keeler with its deep bilge that always contained water no matter how often it was pumped or the potential causes checked. The simple facts are that Bears poop in the woods and boats leak. The various posts are all valid; there are such a plethora of potential causes that its virtually impossible to eliminate them all. Rather, I'd focus on the rate of leakage and the type of fluid, bearing in mind that its often surprisingly hard to determine if water is salt or fresh just by taste; do it often enough and a leak will soon not be at the top of your worry-list. Logically identify the sites that may cause catastrophic leakage on failure and check them thoroughly; once you're reassured of their integrity then anything else falls into the 'nuisance' category. Sketch out and examine the cooling system, the FW system, all discharges and hull penetrations; check your SD water alarm works. If you wish place indicators that will show water at suspect sites or even get an endoscope and check out the bowels of the boat. Having reassured myself that all's good at the start of a season I then just check under the sink and lift a flooring board once or twice a month, inserting the nozzle of an oil-extraction pump into the stringers. Having established the 'normal' amount of leakage I'd only be concerned now if the level had risen dramatically. Its all valuable stuff, making you get to know the boat thoroughly for that time when something goes badly wrong at sea. Besides, my wife says she's glad I've got the boat as I've now no time (or money!) to spend on another woman. |
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H400 (2008) 'Wight Leopard', Gosport UK
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silversailor
Admiral Joined: 25 May 2005 Location: South Haven, MI Status: Offline Points: 1021 |
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One source of this problem has not been mentioned: a separation of the seal between the hull and the liner where the saildrive attaches to the engine. A slight break in that seal will allow sea water to enter sporatically depending on the forces on the hull. That water may be brown, smell woody, look oily as it picks up items left in the course of construction. Left unrepaired the separation will increase as will the amounts of water on board.
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Silversailor
South Haven, MI USA S/V Legacy 2010 Andrews 28 |
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cdhcdh2
Sub Lieutenant Joined: 09 September 2019 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Thanks for this. Sounds like your challenge is of the exact same nature but slightly different (perhaps) location. I have cleaned out every accessible area - under hot water heater, below the muffler/exhaust, bilges, under sinks, by fresh water tank, etc. Smell still remains. Pls keep me in the loop as we try to fix this. The smell is not intolerable but makes me think something is not quite right. Thanks!
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Silver lining
Lieutenant Joined: 23 October 2016 Location: N ireland Status: Offline Points: 41 |
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Chris - I had the same on my 400. I am the second owner but the water was Brown , and slightly oily. Mine gathered in the Bilge under the Galley sink, it had a strange smell, not bad or good but like a 'woody smell ' .
I do not know how the water ended up here?, but I came to the conclusion that it was swishing around the bilges and gathered up all the dust, wood chips, and other small amounts of oil or residue .. I sponged it out , and it has stayed away, - the smell is still there, but this winter I am going to remove the floor boards and clean all the bilges with Bilge X .
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'Silver Lining' 400e #199
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cdhcdh2
Sub Lieutenant Joined: 09 September 2019 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Thank Peter. I wondered if it could be teak oil that had been spilled previously somehow as it stained my hands and is the right color. This boat has a plastic shower seat and no teak below deck so it seemed like an unusual place to find teak oil or it’s residue. It is also more viscous but maybe that is due to slow drying? I have a fan blowing into the shower seat compartment and will see if it “disappears”. Thanks again.
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Rock
Captain Joined: 19 September 2014 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 349 |
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Hi Chris,
Could it simply be water that ran off or through/past wood, or varnish? The 400 has a teak ‘shower seat’, teak could perhaps produce this fluid, from the oily wood, when wet. Welcome to the club! Peter.
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Hanse 400e "M-square2" #0241
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cdhcdh2
Sub Lieutenant Joined: 09 September 2019 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Help please fellow Hanse sailors. I found a brown fluid, slightly oily, smells "woody" or "nutty" - not sewage - in the underfloor section below the shower/head. Wonder what it is and where it came from. Background: boat is 2016 Hanse 385. I am a new owner this summer. Needed to replace the black water holding tank lines as they had become permeated. After removing them, there was still an unusual smell. On reinstalling the sea water inlet line to the head, and while snaking lines to pull the hose through, this substance came back on the snaking tape, like a dipstick. it appears to be deep in the underfloor (not visible) bilge section below the shower/head flood. Taking out the shower drain did not help figure it out. I guess it is possible that the former owner spilled/left to window open or ran shower inadvertently into the pump area under the shower seat. It doesn't appear that there was a holding tank leak at least during my time. I can't determine if it is fresh or salt but I doubt salt. The boat is otherwise in great condition. All sea cocks are fine. All other bilge compartments, keel bolts, and main bilge at bilge pump are dry. So two questions: 1) anyone have an idea what this fluid is? and 2) does anyone think that my spraying soapy water into the section via the shower seat compartment, using a vacuum to remove the water/soap/oil, and trying to dry it out with a fan is a bad idea? My worry of course it that there are electric/conduit lines, hot/cold an other hoses in that section and leaving an oily substance in there might do damage to those elements which must be near impossible to replce. Thank you!
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