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Mainsail Track

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Scot370 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 11 July 2019 at 16:58
New to the forum and bought a 2007 Hanse 370E in May this year. I have been getting the boat sorted out.

I'm impressed with how well the boats sails - 16 knot (+gusts) last weekend, flat water white sail only - fast!

Boat is currently fitted with a main track on the coach roof. I'm looking for what actually works best on the boat, so feedback from owners with main tracks in the cockpit.

Option 1

Fit a main track in the cockpit and have blocks direct up to the end of the boom.


(a) what the best size track / manufacture to go for?
(b) what ratios i.e. 4/1 8/1?

Is the main controllable with this set up?

Option 2

Fit main track in cockpit. Go for German mainsheet arrangement, with the sheet going back to a new pair of cockpit winches (expensive!)

Ed
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Rubato View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rubato Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 July 2019 at 18:06
Why do you want to change from the coach roof setup? This is the standard, cruising approach and changing really isn't going to provide any advantage for cruising.

I changed for racing reasons, I also have a 400 so identical boats really just slightly bigger (and bigger loads) including the main sail.
I tried option 1 first, with a gross/fine tune. Didn't work well.
Then I went for a version of option 2, works excellent - take a look at this link and the setup called 2:1 with dedicated winch.
Works excellent for racing with a dedicated mainsail trimmer.

Can provide some more details if you wish.
Steve


Edited by Rubato - 11 July 2019 at 18:07
Steve

Hanse 400e, #168
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Scot370 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scot370 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 July 2019 at 18:52
Steve
    Thanks for your reply. I want to cruise the boat shorthanded (2 people) and hopefully race the boat occasionally. I want to have the main accessible to the helm. It is nearly impossible to move the main up the main track on the coach roof. I used the Harken mainsheet calculator and it comes up with 588kgs with a wind speed of 20 knots. So I suspected option 1 was not really tenable.

2:1 with dedicated winches looks nice and simple. How have you implemented this system?  What ratios do you have on the mainsheet track traveller? Also manufacture?

Ed
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StavrosNZ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote StavrosNZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 July 2019 at 23:25
Hi Ed, i have 400, 2010 twin wheel version and have converted to German mainsheet system, i can control the main via winch at each helm, very easy.

I have no traveler at all instead have the standard fixed blocks mounted on cabin top. At first i thought i also need a traveler until spending some time sailing with self tacker and realising that with these high aspect non overlapping jibs and the large main you should always have the boom and main to leeward off center to get best air flow angles across the combined sails. This is partly (along with cost) why Hanse elected that no traveler was actually needed and they are correct.

This works well and very happy with the setup.








Edited by StavrosNZ - 11 July 2019 at 23:28
Stephen
2010 H400 #691, Auckland, New Zealand
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Scot370 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scot370 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 July 2019 at 06:41
Stephen

Thanks for posting, it gives me a good understanding of your system.
Two things. I am probably going to use 105% and a local sail maker has suggested 155% when racing. So  I wonder about having the main to leeward / off centre would work with these larger sails? I have not had a yacht before with such a large main and small jib, come to think of it they have all had a large jib and smaller mains, so this is new to me. I am use to letting the main go down the track, to leeward, in the gusts and then back on, when the gust has passed and I need more power.
Also where did you get the fitting for attaching the block to the shroud base?

Ed
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StavrosNZ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote StavrosNZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 July 2019 at 21:21
Hi Ed, My model 400 with inboard shrouds has the long Genoa tracks along deck so I can also use larger overlapping sails and again I find no problem with the lack of traveller. The Hanse main which is large but I my experience in a cruising and club racing situation doesn’t need regular dumping like many boats I have had/used in the past. The overall package is stable and tolerant to a wide range of conditions. I would most certainly try it with German mainsheet conversion before you move to the traveller. 

Serious racing is different scenario and macro trim and ability to open and close the leech become more critical. Ultimately decide if racing or cruising is your priority, if racing a traveller in the cockpit will give you best overall control and performance. If your majority cruising I think you will find lack of traveller is not an issue. 

The fitting on my shroud base for the block is simple 12mm shackle. I purchased longer Clevis pins that suited the additional width through the shackle but you could also use the pin that comes with the shackle if you choose.




Edited by StavrosNZ - 12 July 2019 at 21:32
Stephen
2010 H400 #691, Auckland, New Zealand
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Peter-Blake View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peter-Blake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 July 2019 at 11:05
I own a Hanse 370 since 12 years now.
I have the coachroof traveller. At the beginning i wanted a traveller in the cockpit. As i only race sometimes i got used to the coach roof traveller. And it works since......

......Yes it works since i used one drop from mc-Lube.  Before it simply did not work!
One-Drop changed the world! Since i use One-Drop once or twice a season the traveller works very good even with high loads!

OK- You will not open the traveller in every gust. But you can if you have crew. But even singlehanded (I sail mostly single handed) it is no big deal if you have the autopilot.
Mainly i use the traveller in strong winds to let the sail to leeward. In low winds it is easy to pull the traveller to windward.

OK - a traveller in the cockpit would be a nice to have, but not a must have if you sail mainly in a cruising style.


Edited by Peter-Blake - 13 July 2019 at 11:07
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paul_heinz View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote paul_heinz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 July 2019 at 16:59
As we bought our H400 there was only the coachroof traveller.
We installed an Cockpittraveller and a German Sheeting system. IŽd promised my wife to to use this only for races. She doesnŽt like this on the seating.
One day we used both systems one after the other and after that test nobody would like to take the cockpittraveller away. The ship is far more controllable in stronger winds and its easier to keep it on the windedge if going upwind.


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iemand View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iemand Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 July 2019 at 20:27
I have a 370 with traveller in the cockpit and I'm going directly to two aft whinches for a kind of German Sheeting. I had the coachroof traveller however I knew about a case in france where a joung woman lost her fingertip because of too high loads on the travellersheet. 

After more than 10 years I would not install a traveller in the cockpit again but would go for a single block on the cockpit floor and German Sheeting. That is by far enough with a strong vang. 

The sheet loads are far less with endboom sheeting and the bending loads on the boom is gone.

So in any case end boom sheeting preferable German Sheeting is my vote!

BR Thomas
Hanse 312 MJ 2004 - Hanse 370e MJ 2007
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silversailor View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote silversailor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 July 2019 at 22:59
I have a very early 370 (hull #9) with coachtop traveler.  I added a Harken part that increases the purchase from 4 to 1 to 6 or 8 to 1.  Helps considerable in dealing with the forces the main exerts.

Ed, I also sail with a 155 (actually a 153) and it is perfect in up to 15K.  Above I use a 135.  If I was purchasing new sails today I think I would chose a 108, a 153 and a Code 0. Make sure your sailmaker measures carefully so that the 155 fits.  It was just a little to long for my track.  The addition of adjustable jib cars (from Harken or Garhauer) was one of my best additions.  The 153 would not be nearly as effective without them.
Silversailor
South Haven, MI USA
S/V Legacy
Hanse 370e, #9
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