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Swanji View Drop Down
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Joined: 28 March 2012
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Swanji Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2013 at 09:39
Hi Sam
 
Thats makes sense to me - feathering the kite by releasing the tack and then gathering in the kite by concentrating on clew and trailing edge before focusing on the foot. Thanks Smile
 
Your tip about running an additional line that doubles as a chute tack line and a jib downhaul for offwind sailing has been noted. I have doubled up by using the self tacking sheet as a tack line which is then adjustable in the cockpit and having blocks rigged to a toerail block ( I dont have holes in my toerail) and then attaching individual jib sheets to the clew. When sailing offwind, I simply deactivate the self tacker and use the jib sheets.
 
By the way, do you ever fly the jib plus the main plus the kite at the same time? I have heard that some experienced French sailors like to do this in stronger winds!
 
 
Onwards and upwards

Nidri, Levkada, Ionian, Greece

Hanse 350 #7, SY Evolution, standard keel, 3YM20 sail drive, 3 cabins, cherry wood interior, teak decks, feathering prop
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samuel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2013 at 12:56
In stronger winds my cruiing chute (64m2) overpowers the boat
The problem is that i cannot sail downwind as i could with a spinnaker so being on more of a broad reach the boat can sometimes broach ( as it would with a spinnaker on a reach)
With a spinnaker i could travel more square to the wind & it just gets a bit rolly if i do not clamp it down a bit
In flat seas & light wind i can goosewing the chute but this needs a lot of sheet trimming & this is hard when SH
I am thinking of cutting one of my carbon sailboard masts & using it to help hold the chute in goosewing mode but i still like the odd "blat" in the sailboards so it will have to wait
Daydream Believer- Hanse 311- No GBR9917T- Bradwell Essex
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Swanji View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Swanji Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 June 2013 at 10:24
Coming back to the issue of ST jib versus genoa
Another reason to have a genoa as standard as opposed to the ST jib was highlighted a week ago when we were sailing on a run into Starigrad from an anchorage in Vinisce. The wind was blowing 20knots TWS and we were sailing with full main and jib that was flogging about. I decided to furl the jib and let the main out as far as the spreaders would allow and then applied some backstay and fitted a preventer. We still made a boat speed of around 6.5 to 7 knots BUT i would have been happier sailing with a genoa instead as there is aslways the possibility that the wind could increase further and then it could have been a problem turning head to wind to reef the main. There were no clouds about though and no weather warnings so I felt happy having the main up but still ...
 
 
Onwards and upwards

Nidri, Levkada, Ionian, Greece

Hanse 350 #7, SY Evolution, standard keel, 3YM20 sail drive, 3 cabins, cherry wood interior, teak decks, feathering prop
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gertha View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gertha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 June 2013 at 18:32
Dear Captain Swanji,
Do not worry about running down wind with just a main, when you are totaly overpowered your boat will broach and you will then be head to wind and be able to drop in a couple of reefs; works for me every time.

Best to pack the Gin and Tonic before the broach and use tall glasses for all drinks as a large drink in a short glass can spill also cubes of ice are better than balls.
Swanned off
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Swanji View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Swanji Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 June 2013 at 21:12


Thanks Gertha

I knew I could count on you

Onwards and upwards

Nidri, Levkada, Ionian, Greece

Hanse 350 #7, SY Evolution, standard keel, 3YM20 sail drive, 3 cabins, cherry wood interior, teak decks, feathering prop
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Swanji View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Swanji Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 January 2014 at 07:46
Hi All

To revisit this brilliant topic :)))

Reed's Handbook for Skippers which is a brilliant little publication for this who don't know it talk about the approach to sailing to a destination that is directly into wind. The advice is to draw 2 lines from the windward destination to your position 15 degrees either side of the rhum line that would take you directly their and then to execute a series tacks which become shorter and shorter as you reach the destination. Alternatively tack when the destination is 15 degrees from your rhum line. The reason given is that this will Max out your VMG and also leaves you open to benefiting from a wind shift which may allow you to sail directly there. My approach up until now has been to wing it or to sail on one tack until I know that the next tack will take me to the mark without having to tack again. The problem with this approach is I lose the benefit of a wind shift.

Which brings me to the debate Mark and Steve have been having in the Hanse in Dubai thread - sorry Mark. the advice when sailing downwind if I have it correctly is

- in breezes of around 10 knots, sail on a broad reach at around 140 degrees to maximize VMG.
- for every 1 knot increase in wind strength, you can sail deeper down wind by 5 degrees which for the mathematicians means that an increase of 8 knots means you could be sailing DDW
- this advice seems to apply for those with spinnakers?
- alternatively sail directly to destination assuming you have a pole for the pesky headsail
- alternately furl the headsail and just sail on mainsail direct to destination if you have no pole or a spinnaker if not having any fun but speed is your criteria

Right?
Onwards and upwards

Nidri, Levkada, Ionian, Greece

Hanse 350 #7, SY Evolution, standard keel, 3YM20 sail drive, 3 cabins, cherry wood interior, teak decks, feathering prop
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Swanji View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Swanji Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 April 2014 at 10:18
Hi All

So a question for all ye experts out there on using the vang.

We have an upgraded vang on Evolution and the usual standard German sheeting system with blocks on the coachroof - no traveller. We therefore make use of the vang when sailing into wind as well as downwind so that when we release the mainsheet to de power, the leech tension is maintained. I think most of us are aware of this but my question is this

- when sailing in light winds, I don't use the vang at all to achieve the required sail twist
- as the wind picks up, I flatten the sail by applying kicker which obviously tensions the leech reducing twist.
-
my first reefing tactic is to apply backstay to flatten the top part of the sail further. This of course will take some pressure off the leech which would further depower the main.

At what point though, do you scandalise the main by releasing the kicker to further depower the main? I suppose thinking about it, the first "reef" is to use backstay and the second "reef" is to release the kicker before putting in the first reef.

Any thoughts or comments?

I would post some images of us sailing along but I need to rename my image files and haven't figured out how to do that from an iPad



Edited by Swanji - 04 April 2014 at 10:25
Onwards and upwards

Nidri, Levkada, Ionian, Greece

Hanse 350 #7, SY Evolution, standard keel, 3YM20 sail drive, 3 cabins, cherry wood interior, teak decks, feathering prop
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Swanji View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Swanji Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 April 2014 at 10:32
Hi All

Another question for all you experienced fellows

What is the thinking behind using the mainsail and the assymmetrical kite at the same time when sailing downwind? Is it better to sail under kite alone to avoid having the mainsail create a wind shadow for the kite? Or do the kite and mainsail work together in a conventional sense with the slot between mainsail and kite creating more drive?

How does this change the deeper downwind you are wanting to go? I have found that the mainsail really starts to interfere with the kite as you sail deeper.

How about light winds as in 5 knots? Again I have found that the mainsail can blanket the kite to a degree even when sailing on a broad reach in light wind conditions.

We are using our new bowsprit /prodder for the first time with adjustable tack line and this really works well!

I am a mainsail and kite sailor at present but my sailing partner on this trip reckons sailing under kite only is the way to go so we are in disagreement to some extent and some of the time
Onwards and upwards

Nidri, Levkada, Ionian, Greece

Hanse 350 #7, SY Evolution, standard keel, 3YM20 sail drive, 3 cabins, cherry wood interior, teak decks, feathering prop
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fendant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 April 2014 at 11:54
Tagging on to Swanji's question:
 
In light winds downhill would it be better to use the gennie only without the main ?
Any experiences?
Frank
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Mark&Catherine View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mark&Catherine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 April 2014 at 13:44
We have tried both. Genoa or jib with no main in light winds is very slow, not practical. We use a whisker pole so that we can goose wing the genoa , we take an additional sheet to the gennaker or asymmetric sheet block, use a halliard as an up haul on the pole, in light winds you don't need a down haul. By the way we have even tried the pole to hold to the clew of the Genny on the same side as the main, it helps the shape of the sail on deep reaches, and you can gybe the main back and forth to find the best speed angle combination. Using a separate sheet makes handling the pole easier.


We regularly fly just the gennaker or asymmetric when we are on a relaxing cruise, and yes you can go deeper than with main up, but of course you don't go as fast. We do this in stronger winds too, as the speed we get is good. We can goose wing the genoa and main in light winds if you use a line from the midship cleat to the genoa sheet to pull the clew of the sail down.

We have also rigged the whisker pole to move the tack of the asymmetric to windward in light winds so more of the sail is presented beyond the main and hence you can sail deeper. We only do this when racing as you need up haul, down haul and additional sheet.

So my summary in light winds goose wing with a pole is best unless you use the gennaker. If we are relaxed we just use the gennaker without the main.

385 ubulukutu sail number GBR 3350L in Turkey and Greece with Mark and Catherine
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